For me focusing on the material or physical world and forgetting my souls growth processes is extremely painful for me. To me I cannot forget my personal growth and focus on material or physical goals.

My material wealth demands that I forget my soul, but that's the whole thing I never want to forget my soul.

There's a balance that's required but even then, I feel the balance is empty of soul growth.

I always did what was needed of me in my youth, then I hit a chemistry change that demanded that I develop myself for fulfillment - I had to be my own best friend.

Now I am trying to expand being my own best friend, to include physical and material goals.

One thing I learnt is that when luxury turns to necessity those are the areas we love ourselves. For instance I think that exercise is not a necessity it's a luxury, but if I loved myself it would become a necessity.

But I feel sick about loving myself so much as to make luxuries necessities.

I am still a very dependent person and I can't see much hope for myself to create an independent life.

I have done work on loving myself more, but I am hitting a negative wall of "Don't love yourself so much" from those around me.

I thought self-love would be a tonic but now I feel guilty about it.

I may be hitting the biggest wall of a paradigm in my life and those around me or I may be guilty of too much self-love or I may be too spiritual, or not humble enough to selfishly chase my own goals. Too good for earthly good. Too self-effacing.

I think that I can only truly deny myself after the stage of self-love. I have denied myself even before I love myself, and I don't think that is the virtuous self-denial. I think that is evil self-effacement.

All though I have mentioned my beliefs I'm not accepting any of it as "The Way". I'm still very curious about "The Way".

I realise there are very spiritual people on this forum that maybe could help me.

[This message has been edited by Grant (edited January 15, 2006).]

Vita-man

I'm walking straight into the darkness. My shadows may start looking friendly!

"Focusing outwardly without feeling left behind."

Funny I think the Boundless Renewal Course helps with this.

Ha Ha! True Wealth is on it's way!

Idries Shah emphasized again and again that one of the prerequisites for real spiritual growth was being able to sufficiently handle one's needs.

I take that to mean that spiritual growth is built upon the firm foundation of having your material needs met. I think this includes social needs, dealing with your ego and personality.

There's no real separation between spiritual and material. Your day to day activities are spiritual. Earning money, buying food, eating it, eliminating it--they're all part of the experience of being human, all part of an ongoing story... part of a mythic, spiritual process.

Having to earn teaches us about the suffering of this world and the suffering of all living beings. It teaches us about exchange, one thing for another. It teaches us that humans are being who create, and that the smallest participation is part of the growth of a larger process.

The same with buying food, eating it, passing it through your system and back into the world....

It isn't that your activities are void of spirituality, maybe your perceptions of them are.

The entire world and all of its mundanity was resplendent with divinity to Rumi.